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Rank: Main: Dark Steel Level: 9138 Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2006 10:35 am Posts: 2068 Location: Netherlands |
Because we still want a prawn to be a glass cannon sort of ship. You are forgetting that these bonuses that are built into the ship will not be affected by Aug tweaking so it will be much much weaker than an actual installed augmented.
_________________ ~DarkSteel / Auxilium Universe Map: http://www.starsonata.com/map/ |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:33 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Officer Main: Mow Level: 9760 Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 2:57 pm Posts: 4731 Location: Kuratovo, Russia |
The inbuilt mods on it are fine as they are. They don't need any more.
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Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:39 pm |
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over 9000!
Main: enkelin
Level: 5600 Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:28 pm Posts: 11109 |
Tomzta09 wrote: The inbuilt mods on it are fine as they are. They don't need any more. I don't think the ship would be used with 3 augs if we didn't change the hull augmods. Don't forget how strong the Wattage is, especially with two capacitors. _________________ Hi, I'm Anil, a long-time player turned developer. I am Star Sonata's lead content developer, which means that I run weekly dev meetings and make sure that any proposed changes to the game receive proper review before going live. http://www.starsonata.com/features |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:55 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Peon Main: The White Wizard Level: 4276 Joined: Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:28 am Posts: 252 |
anilv wrote: Tomzta09 wrote: The inbuilt mods on it are fine as they are. They don't need any more. I don't think the ship would be used with 3 augs if we didn't change the hull augmods. Don't forget how strong the Wattage is, especially with two capacitors. If you're going to nerf the prawn (which has to be done) then nerf it properly. _________________ |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 1:09 pm |
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over 9000!
Main: enkelin
Level: 5600 Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:28 pm Posts: 11109 |
I will, if properly means giving it a proper use compared to other T21 ships. I am not going to just nerf it into oblivion for no reason.
_________________ Hi, I'm Anil, a long-time player turned developer. I am Star Sonata's lead content developer, which means that I run weekly dev meetings and make sure that any proposed changes to the game receive proper review before going live. http://www.starsonata.com/features |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 1:11 pm |
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Main: ShawnMcCall
Level: 2589 Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:42 am Posts: 1932 |
Pontius123 wrote: the white wizard wrote: What's the point of removing the fourth aug slot if you're going to add inbuilt mods almost as good as an aug. This. People who augged 2 CaL 2 Dwatt would simply augged it 1 CaL 2 Dwatt. True to an extent. Inbuilt bonuses are not affected by AT so it would be like having half a CAL. Still kind of over powered though. Maybe a +DPS, +elec temp to give damage, but make it harder to sustain. Or play off of the prawn claw, make it give like -50% resists inside of 300 range and just don't give the prawn any Inbuilt bonuses for the fourth Aug removal, let the beef be a DPS boost from staying very close (actively piloting) to your enemy. This would also help preserve the ship's utility for FC and Berserker post nerf. |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 1:33 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Peon Main: The White Wizard Level: 4276 Joined: Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:28 am Posts: 252 |
ShawnMcCall wrote: Pontius123 wrote: the white wizard wrote: What's the point of removing the fourth aug slot if you're going to add inbuilt mods almost as good as an aug. This. People who augged 2 CaL 2 Dwatt would simply augged it 1 CaL 2 Dwatt. True to an extent. Inbuilt bonuses are not affected by AT so it would be like having half a CAL. Still kind of over powered though. Maybe a +DPS, +elec temp to give damage, but make it harder to sustain. Or play off of the prawn claw, make it give like -50% resists inside of 300 range and just don't give the prawn any Inbuilt bonuses for the fourth Aug removal, let the beef be a DPS boost from staying very close (actively piloting) to your enemy. This would also help preserve the ship's utility for FC and Berserker post nerf. Have you perhaps missed the "oh well only my fc prawn will be affected by this nerf". I'd take -50% resist aura to enemies even for the price of 4 aug slots. _________________ |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 2:18 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Officer Main: Mow Level: 9760 Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 2:57 pm Posts: 4731 Location: Kuratovo, Russia |
Of course the Prawn will still be used. The only other alternative is Wattage. The Prawn Claw should in my opinion just be removed.
Increase the inbuilt damage and +elec tempering, that way you have two choices for High Vis Sniper: Wattage for more sustain and power, and Prawn for less sustain and more damage. _________________ |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:00 pm |
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Main: The Shaft of Discipline
Level: 3680 Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 6:45 pm Posts: 1082 |
Like the Shrimp, the Selen, the Scrupling, the Hotrod, the Battle Thatch, the Paxian Battle Frigate, the Battle Sphere, and the Heph Machine (which also needs a nerf), the whole point of the Prawn should be the additional aug slot. Without the extra aug, it should be a pretty weak ship with a considerable obtain cost.
Using the Shrimp as an example, the Shrimp is: A. Slow B. Lower than average hull space C. Little more than half the resists of contemporaries D. Lacking weapon slots of "true" Berserker HFs E. Unstealthy as fuck for its size; there are bigger ships that are more stealthy The Shrimp got a dorky Omni-Launcher as a buff sometime ago. The Shrimp is AI obtainable, so stats may not be as good as they could be (or hell, they could get worse). So the Prawn should reflect these values. It's slow as fuck (muchhhh slower on a Zerk), low resists, lower than average hull, low weapon slot count, and is so un-stealthy that an EFDN would be a viable seer ambush ship in comparison. To prevent serious MC bullshit, it should also have a significant Tracking and or Range nerf. I'm leaning towards the Tracking nerf because it would hurt MCers more. Even better if you can turn a full tracking weapon like a KMW into a low tracking weapon like a Shockwave with such a big Tracking hit. The benefit of the Prawn Claw would be the reasoning behind the Range/Tracking nerf. The alternative would be to replace the Prawn Claw with a Prawn Omni-Launcher like on the Shrimp. What good is an extra 10k dps off missiles and fighters when the average Prawn is kicking out 120k+ non-tweaked DPS? _________________ Reddit Space Invaders! |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:22 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Soldier Main: LemonPrime Level: 8124 Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:14 pm Posts: 5747 |
I see Churchill came back to haunt the forums.
_________________ Lemon/Meo |
Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:39 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Peon Main: The White Wizard Level: 4276 Joined: Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:28 am Posts: 252 |
Pontius123 wrote: Like the Shrimp, the Selen, the Scrupling, the Hotrod, the Battle Thatch, the Paxian Battle Frigate, the Battle Sphere, and the Heph Machine (which also needs a nerf), the whole point of the Prawn should be the additional aug slot. Without the extra aug, it should be a pretty weak ship with a considerable obtain cost. Using the Shrimp as an example, the Shrimp is: A. Slow B. Lower than average hull space C. Little more than half the resists of contemporaries D. Lacking weapon slots of "true" Berserker HFs E. Unstealthy as fuck for its size; there are bigger ships that are more stealthy The Shrimp got a dorky Omni-Launcher as a buff sometime ago. The Shrimp is AI obtainable, so stats may not be as good as they could be (or hell, they could get worse). So the Prawn should reflect these values. It's slow as fuck (muchhhh slower on a Zerk), low resists, lower than average hull, low weapon slot count, and is so un-stealthy that an EFDN would be a viable seer ambush ship in comparison. To prevent serious MC bullshit, it should also have a significant Tracking and or Range nerf. I'm leaning towards the Tracking nerf because it would hurt MCers more. Even better if you can turn a full tracking weapon like a KMW into a low tracking weapon like a Shockwave with such a big Tracking hit. The benefit of the Prawn Claw would be the reasoning behind the Range/Tracking nerf. The alternative would be to replace the Prawn Claw with a Prawn Omni-Launcher like on the Shrimp. What good is an extra 10k dps off missiles and fighters when the average Prawn is kicking out 120k+ non-tweaked DPS? Prawn snipers can get 700k-800k untweaked burst dps at this moment, it should be ~400k tops, though removing the inbuilt stats and adding some negative stats could make it well balanced with the 4 aug slots. The prawn aura is something that no one (but me obviously) actually uses, it's not OP and not useless either, there's no need to remove that. So for the devs to make it simple, let's balance it so the prawn dps can't get higher than 400k. If you remove an aug and add some +dps stats which could be a fourth aug, then the prawns still get 500k+ dps which is broken. If you're going to balance, then do it properly enkelin. _________________ |
Tue Aug 30, 2016 6:16 am |
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Contributor
Team:
Rank: Main: Dark Steel Level: 9138 Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2006 10:35 am Posts: 2068 Location: Netherlands |
the white wizard wrote: Pontius123 wrote: Like the Shrimp, the Selen, the Scrupling, the Hotrod, the Battle Thatch, the Paxian Battle Frigate, the Battle Sphere, and the Heph Machine (which also needs a nerf), the whole point of the Prawn should be the additional aug slot. Without the extra aug, it should be a pretty weak ship with a considerable obtain cost. Using the Shrimp as an example, the Shrimp is: A. Slow B. Lower than average hull space C. Little more than half the resists of contemporaries D. Lacking weapon slots of "true" Berserker HFs E. Unstealthy as fuck for its size; there are bigger ships that are more stealthy The Shrimp got a dorky Omni-Launcher as a buff sometime ago. The Shrimp is AI obtainable, so stats may not be as good as they could be (or hell, they could get worse). So the Prawn should reflect these values. It's slow as fuck (muchhhh slower on a Zerk), low resists, lower than average hull, low weapon slot count, and is so un-stealthy that an EFDN would be a viable seer ambush ship in comparison. To prevent serious MC bullshit, it should also have a significant Tracking and or Range nerf. I'm leaning towards the Tracking nerf because it would hurt MCers more. Even better if you can turn a full tracking weapon like a KMW into a low tracking weapon like a Shockwave with such a big Tracking hit. The benefit of the Prawn Claw would be the reasoning behind the Range/Tracking nerf. The alternative would be to replace the Prawn Claw with a Prawn Omni-Launcher like on the Shrimp. What good is an extra 10k dps off missiles and fighters when the average Prawn is kicking out 120k+ non-tweaked DPS? Prawn snipers can get 700k-800k untweaked burst dps at this moment, it should be ~400k tops, though removing the inbuilt stats and adding some negative stats could make it well balanced with the 4 aug slots. The prawn aura is something that no one (but me obviously) actually uses, it's not OP and not useless either, there's no need to remove that. So for the devs to make it simple, let's balance it so the prawn dps can't get higher than 400k. If you remove an aug and add some +dps stats which could be a fourth aug, then the prawns still get 500k+ dps which is broken. If you're going to balance, then do it properly enkelin. Show me a screeny of your 700k+ burst DPS, I don't buy it. In either case you will nolonger be able to do such numbers since we're getting rid of MF2ing. I doubt we'll see anything above 250, maybe 300k after we're done here. _________________ ~DarkSteel / Auxilium Universe Map: http://www.starsonata.com/map/ |
Tue Aug 30, 2016 6:22 am |
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Member
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Rank: Officer Main: topbuzzz Level: 8015 Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2008 12:31 pm Posts: 4347 |
this was in his mythical calculator though remember
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Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:06 am |
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Team:
Rank: Officer Main: Mow Level: 9760 Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 2:57 pm Posts: 4731 Location: Kuratovo, Russia |
Either way, probably the best way to fix the Prawn once and for all would be taking away the 4th aug slot. As Voom said, it was okay'ish at first but not anymore. Much like the United States of America, it was a good idea but it's long gotten out of hand.
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Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:09 am |
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Team:
Rank: Officer Main: Chrono Warrior Level: 5817 Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:36 pm Posts: 328 |
the white wizard wrote: The prawn aura is something that no one (but me obviously) actually uses, it's not OP and not useless either, there's no need to remove that. I know a few people who have made prawns specifically for their FC's to utilize said aura, so you are definitely not "the only one". the white wizard wrote: Prawn snipers can get 700k-800k untweaked burst dps at this moment, it should be ~400k tops... Myeah, I don't buy that either, show me a screenie or get out of here with those maths. - Chrono _________________ anilv wrote: #feelthethrm |
Tue Aug 30, 2016 12:12 pm |
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