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Post Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Obviously, SS is NOT ready for a release on Steam Greenlight. However, given that that is coming, I thought that we, as a playerbase, should cobble together a master list of the things we believe need to be addressed, fixed, patched, changed, etc. before all the Steam hits the fan (lol).

No off topic posts, keep it to discussion of this only. Uhmari is banned from participating.

Post last updated 5/7/2016 8:10PM PST, current to Page 7, post 748360.



Completed List:
Item - Status
  • H needs to be a toggle for UI visibility, not a deadman's switch as it is now. - Jey added a command to the client which changes this per session. Good enough, I suppose.
  • Beef the hell out of bases, to push them beyond even T22 player strength. - HOLY CRAP, IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED!
  • Galaxies feel empty and meaningless - all they serve, aside from newbie base-building fodder, is to chronically pad out the distance between you and the special POI system you want to explore. - Universes seem to have very few filler galaxies now.
  • Better wiki layout, and synergy with the game would be nice, for example the '?' could open the wiki ingame as a resizable in game window instead of opening your primary browser as it currently does. - Game Database integration underway, and the ? button apparently opens a Steam browser with the Steam client. Waiting on Steam launch to verify.



Incomplete/WIP List:
Item - Status
  • Redo the entire Nexus and the introduction to the game. - Possibly Completed. Not put into the game yet.
  • Rework the voice tutorial, it's annoying as shit and I don't think anyone actually wants to listen to someone tell them how to play the game. - Possibly being removed (thank heavens).
  • Most missions need trimmed down, wall of text-wise. - Completed for Nexus, rest of game still wall-o-texty.
  • Make a bunch of LINEAR mission paths, that will lead you to level 500 or so, maybe even 1k. - Colored Empires, Arctia, Vulcan, Jungle. Good progress. Nothing unites these zones yet, though.
  • Story-line would be great. - SS, as usual, has less storyline than a movie poster.
  • Secure trade interface. - Worked on in the past, does not yet exist.
  • Better low level class balance so seers can function, FC/Gunner aren't overpowered. - Tied in to next item.
  • Low level classes need to feel different and exciting, more of what gunners and zerkers have with there immediate multifiring bonuses. - In progress. Apparently Class Super Items were a massively failed attempt to solve this.
  • Knowing where to get skills is a big deal. Skills are spread out everywhere with no guide to where they are. - Possibly worked on.
  • Wiki auto-updating system using actual game balance tables. Will likely not happen due to the fact that the admins want players to discover stats and post them to the wiki. - WIP by the Devmins. Biggee and I never got started.
  • Not only should space points be redesigned and cost less, but make a description for services that are bought with space points, anyone that doesn't know much about SS will not know what item-forming means, or augmenter reset. - Descriptions exist (though minimal), but they are still too expensive.
  • Faction specific zones (playerbase is split on this one) - Sort of not really anything yet.
  • REDO. SUBSPACE. FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING. A contestable battlezone, if you please. - Sort of worked on? Alien base building was redone, but I don't do subspace so I wouldn't know if this did anything.
  • Smooth transition between Nexus and the rest of the galaxy. No storyline guides new players out into the main universe. - Sort of not really? The information available about this is incomplete and sparse.
  • Regular, complete, detailed patch notes. - Halfway there.
  • Resize the space objects (planets, stars, asteroids) to better reflect how things are sized in the real world. -Stars have been made much larger with the May 7th universe, and planets now have random sizes. Asteroid fields have been given random resource allotments. Not quite there, but good progress.


No Progress List:
Item - Status
  • Either remove Pirate/Earthforce Affliation, or make it actually affect how the game starts. - Nothing so far.
  • Some sort of mail/messaging system. - Does not exist.
  • The radar range circle. - Nothing yet.
  • Focus on making it easier for players to level and ensure that there is actually some sort of meaningful conflict to participate in. - Nothing yet.
  • Slaves/Drones/Missiles/Fighters have next to no explanation. Little information is known about them to low level players. - Nothing yet.
  • Space Points need to be redesigned, services using them need to cost less. - Nothing yet.
  • The client needs to recognize and be able to open web links. - Nothing yet.
  • All text in the client needs to be selectable and copyable, including that inside chat. - Nothing yet.
  • Some way to educate players that you don't need to do missions to progress in the game. - Nothing yet.
  • SS's larger universe - that is, the procedurally-generated random galaxies in between here and there - is being ignored. Full post: Here - Nothing yet.
    • Random AI swarms (especially in west W-1) can frequently bring down newer players while they're on their way to content zones or even to just finish a particular mission chain. - Nothing yet.
    • Dire need for rebalancing much of the game's pre-existing low-tech gear. SS doesn't really "take off" until T10. - Nothing yet.
  • The game needs to be streamlined. The new player experience and the leveling experience needs to be looked at across the board. Leveling is very tedious, and there's a distinct lack of direction and intuitiveness; people find themselves not knowing where to get important skills or where to go next. Full post: Here - Nothing yet.
  • Map Filters, using Danger Factor as a base for rendering them. - Nothing yet.
  • Rename Galaxies to Star Systems or just Systems, while renaming Layers to Galaxies, e.g. Earthforce Galaxy. The current naming schema is confusing to everyone but the current playerbase. - Nothing yet.
  • AI Level does not match their strength. - Nothing yet.
  • Lack of clear guide on what to kill to increase player level. - Nothing yet.
  • Create incentive for conflict, incentive for interaction. Increase commodity rarity, perhaps even making certain zones where certain commods show up, forcing interteam conflict and trade. - Nothing yet.
  • Disable or severely nerf Multiclienting. It is the most broken thing about SS as it is, enabling content designed for groups of players to be soloed, as well as stupidly destroying fairness in PVP. A possibility is to limit computers to a single client running at any one time. True, this can be gotten around by VMs, or using multiple computers, but that level of effort must still be expended. - Nothing yet.
  • Shove the Nerf Stick so far up the Colony Whore backside it can never be removed. - Nothing yet.
  • PVE and PVP Queues. - Nothing yet.
  • Fix item transference glitch (item appears in multiple inventories after moving) - Nothing yet.
  • Inventory windows sometimes change to show other ships than the ones they were opened to view. Fix. - Nothing yet.
  • Instance the Nexus - Nothing yet.

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Star Sonata is not ready for a release on Steam. See this topic for what we think should be done about it.
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Last edited by thecrazygamemaster on Sat May 07, 2016 10:17 pm, edited 16 times in total.

Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:32 pm
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Redo the entire Nexus and the introduction to the game.

Either remove Pirate/Earthforce Affliation, or make it actually affect how the game starts.

Rework the voice tutorial, it's annoying as shit and I don't think anyone actually wants to listen to someone tell them how to play the game.

Most missions need trimmed down, wall of text-wise.

Make a bunch of LINEAR mission paths, that will lead you to level 500 or so, maybe even 1k.

Story-line would be great.

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Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:34 pm
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Secure trade interface.

Some sort of mail/messaging system

Better low level class balance so seers can function, FC/Gunner arnt overpowerd.

Low level classes need to feel different and exciting, more of what gunners and zerkers have with there immediate multifiring bonuses.


Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:43 pm
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
The radar range circle should be fixed asap.

Some cut scenes would be epic.

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:35 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
redalert150 wrote:
The radar range circle should be fixed asap.

Some cut scenes would be epic.


Cut scenes are nice but please be serious it isn't what SS needs the most of.

The midgame has been gutted due to power creep and the stagnation of PvP has not helped. Focus on making it easier for players to level and ensure that there is actually some sort of meaningful conflict to participate in. The former is hard but the latter is nigh impossible.

Start with the level progression and make sure players are properly infomed about core game mechanics. Reinvigorating PvP and emp runs will not be easy and will require a steady influx of new players to help bring life back into the game. A bunch of old grizzly vets aren't about to relive the glory days on their own as we have seen. Ensuring a small but steady influx of new players reach the endgame; will help significantly with the games overall atmosphere. As for the specifics I cannot offer much since I can't point out exactly what went wrong where. What I can say is we need new players.

I would like to point out that the vast majority of MMO's fail to properly address power creep and waning player enthusiasm. If SS succeeds in this task it will be only a handful that have managed to pull it off. Cooperating with the development team and giving useful feedback is required to even have a shot at this. It just so happens this particular dev team doesn't have its head up its ass and actually posts on the forums. I wouldn't bother posting otherwise and I'm very interested to see what others have to say.

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:39 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
There already are storyline missions!

Earthforce/Paxian/Blue Pirates/East Vindia!

If the admins stretch and flesh those missions out they will have a wonderful little storyline that could potentially last players up until level 500+.

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:00 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Lots of players like knowing exactly what they need to do in order to progress. I think that's one of the biggest barriers for some players, just the fact that they don't know what to do after leaving the nexus. I'm not sure of the best way to remedy this in-game, but what I can contribute personally would be some kind of infographic for the various storyline missions that start in EF space. Basically, I don't know if there's enough direction for many players to be hooked right off the bat.

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:36 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Knowing where to get skills is a big deal, a friend of mine got really frustrated because he couldn't just level skills when he had skill points. Not being able to go to one place to train everything pissed him off.

You're going to encounter people who feel the same way, and a way to find out exactly where they need to go and what they need to do in order to get those skills will help mitigate that.

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:49 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
I am already working on improving skill training by splitting it into two types, one that is more handholding themed with missions (that gives you all the information you need, we are also using this to direct players to level appropriate content etc.) and one that is more sandbox type where the player needs to find out most of the information on his own :)

This will not be done for the universe reset, but when it is done we should be able to patch it in during an existing universe :D

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:53 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
MasterTrader wrote:
Knowing where to get skills is a big deal, a friend of mine got really frustrated because he couldn't just level skills when he had skill points. Not being able to go to one place to train everything pissed him off.

You're going to encounter people who feel the same way, and a way to find out exactly where they need to go and what they need to do in order to get those skills will help mitigate that.


The best way to solve this imo would be:

Open up your skills panel, click on a skill. It shows you the closest known galaxy that has that skill available as well as the limit that it offers. If it takes any required commods, it would also list those bolded and in a different color.

If there isn't a place that you've discovered that has it, maybe have that based on exploration? Or you can ask in all chat I guess. I'm not too sure honestly because I think exploration is important. However, I don't think it should be a 100% hindrance to progression.

I think something like that would be the best short-term solution while still retaining some mystery about the game.

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:58 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Just a few things:

Definitely in there with Biggee. After level 100 or so I don't know where to progress. There's no mission chain to show me to an area that has AI within my level area. Instead I have to go out and find very few AI's that roam certain areas and kill them, maybe only 10 or so an hour if I killed off all the spawn. Basically having a mission chain that goes from ~100 or so to somewhere close to W3 ai levels would be great, even if it does have much or a story, but a dedicated area where I can find groups of AI at my level. (Even just galaxies where there are AIs centered around a certain level would be good. Like 100-200 ais in a galaxy cluster, level 175-300 in a cluster, 250-350 in a cluster, etc., with a few themed AI bases to those ais so that it looks like it has a story to it. I'm thinking like the Paxians had control of this area but some Urqa took over and the two sides are just fighting. Urqa spawn pretty consistently all over and one or two Paxians spawn near the AI bases that are leveled under the Urqa. But only the Paxians are teamed so the Urqa don't swarm. Nothing major, just like a mission to get to each new cluster to show you where it is and then maybe missions to kill a few of the Urqa, I know there's roaming Urqa ships that could be used and Paxians have enough already, it shouldn't be much) Sorry for the huge suggestion at this point

As for not knowing where skills are, I do have that problem sometime, only because the missions that tell me to get Piloting up or something tell me a galaxy that I have not yet found, or a commod that I cannot get. Instead I travel all over to random AI stations to upgrade my skills.

With the intro of C2 and the skill changes, I also don't know how to do a lot anymore and so I'm going to list all I can think of while still at work:

Slaves:
* Honestly don't know restrictions on these. At one point I thought it was changed so that the tech level of the slave ship was the restriction on tech gear allowed but I've found that isn't the case.
* Where to get combat controlbots is never told. I just knew to try Copper
* Slave stasis gens? Yes/No? Do I need them?
* Can they use missiles and fighters? Drones? Drone factories/superitems?

Drones:
* Without knowing the stats of the weapon they use, I have no idea what drones are useful toward what AI. This includes weapon type (heat, rad, laser, etc), shield, energy.
* I had no idea what would happen after the timespan or if they died, having an explanation of them timing out and becoming deactivated or when they died that they would still be there.

Missiles/Fighters:
* Explanation on use/what you need for these would be great. I still don't know where to get the stuff for them.
* Buying the weaker ammo crates from AI bases
* Are there weaker fighters in AI bases as well?
- Side note: The point of missiles and fighters are that any class can use them, but the specific focus/class gets a HUGE upgrade to them. from what I know, the ammo crates and missile/fighter bays are sold in Lyceum at a class-locked base. These items should be open to all players, the same as drones, but have a few (much better) class locked items.

SPACEPOINTS!!!:
* The website kind of does a shit job explaining these. They can be used to pay for a sub. But also name changes too. Then there's TWO items that can be bought in game (Somewhere? - I have no idea where as I'm only on a F2P account now) .
* What is the SP cost of those two items? I am tempted to go onto this account, pay a sub and item form and aug reset a few of my ships and send them to my F2P account, but I don't know how much it is and my guess from everything I've heard, its nowhere near worth it.

Wiki:
This needs a huge upgrade. I'm assuming that most of the gear ingame is listed in a database somewhere. If that is the case the wiki could be redone so that all in game items are categorized by the tags on items and displayed on the wiki with up-to-date stats. I've done the work before and it shouldn't be terrible, but it would take someone with access to that database to setup a read-only permission account to the item tables and then write some code to format everything properly. The game does the same thing, it just would need a bit of work. I know MediaWiki (The base system used for the wiki) allows this type of system and it would really help people look through and find what gear they could use. Then all they need to do is /mc on the itemname and they can find where to get it if it is sold or ask someone in all chat who knows.

That was a lot longer than I expected for writing at work...

EDIT: I have no idea what *denotes no discount means

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Last edited by Golfman560 on Fri Jun 20, 2014 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Fri Jun 20, 2014 10:29 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Golfman560 wrote:
Just a few things:

Definitely in there with Biggee. After level 100 or so I don't know where to progress. There's no mission chain to show me to an area that has AI within my level area. Instead I have to go out and find very few AI's that roam certain areas and kill them, maybe only 10 or so an hour if I killed off all the spawn. Basically having a mission chain that goes from ~100 or so to somewhere close to W3 ai levels would be great, even if it does have much or a story, but a dedicated area where I can find groups of AI at my level. (Even just galaxies where there are AIs centered around a certain level would be good. Like 100-200 ais in a galaxy cluster, level 175-300 in a cluster, 250-350 in a cluster, etc., with a few themed AI bases to those ais so that it looks like it has a story to it. I'm thinking like the Paxians had control of this area but some Urqa took over and the two sides are just fighting. Urqa spawn pretty consistently all over and one or two Paxians spawn near the AI bases that are leveled under the Urqa. But only the Paxians are teamed so the Urqa don't swarm. Nothing major, just like a mission to get to each new cluster to show you where it is and then maybe missions to kill a few of the Urqa, I know there's roaming Urqa ships that could be used and Paxians have enough already, it shouldn't be much) Sorry for the huge suggestion at this point

...


This is something The Vert and I have been making a big push on -- dedicated content zones that players get directed to that offer AI to level on. Arctia (20-50) and Vulcan (20-100) are the first 2 instances of this, but there will definitely be more in the future (an UrQa / Paxian zone was actually planned!). Some other examples are Blue Outpost, Blanco and the Auric Sector. But definitely keep looking for more zones like this

ELITE wrote:
Redo the entire Nexus and the introduction to the game.
...
Rework the voice tutorial, it's annoying as shit and I don't think anyone actually wants to listen to someone tell them how to play the game.

Most missions need trimmed down, wall of text-wise.

Make a bunch of LINEAR mission paths, that will lead you to level 500 or so, maybe even 1k.

...


The entire Nexus was just redone. Changes mostly focused on increasing the tempo of the Nexus and better explaining the most important aspects of the game. We also trimmed a LOT of text from the Nexus. Most mission descriptions are down to a few lines max.

We've also trimmed a lot of the Tutorial out (and might just scrap it entirely). I definitely agree it's clunky and kind of annoying at times.

Also, there are linear mission paths to level 500 now (I reworked all the existing mission content and supplemented it where needed on the pirate front). Maybe they're not obvious enough though?

Continued feedback on all of this would definitely be appreciated though.

urzaserra256 wrote:
Secure trade interface.

Some sort of mail/messaging system

Better low level class balance so seers can function, FC/Gunner arnt overpowerd.

Low level classes need to feel different and exciting, more of what gunners and zerkers have with there immediate multifiring bonuses.


We have some very big plans on low level class balance that hopefully we can get working on ASAP. Class Super Items were a part of this, but they're definitely not helping enough.

I am pretty sure we did have a secure trade interface in the works at one point, I'm not too sure what happened to it. I agree it would be extremely useful.

I really like all the feedback in this thread. It's positive and constructive. Keep it up!

Calypso

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 11:03 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
ELITE wrote:
Redo the entire Nexus and the introduction to the game.

Either remove Pirate/Earthforce Affliation, or make it actually affect how the game starts.

Rework the voice tutorial, it's annoying as shit and I don't think anyone actually wants to listen to someone tell them how to play the game.

Most missions need trimmed down, wall of text-wise.

Make a bunch of LINEAR mission paths, that will lead you to level 500 or so, maybe even 1k.

Story-line would be great.


Story line with Animated cut Scenes?

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 11:08 am
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Golfman560 wrote:
SPACEPOINTS!!!:
* The website kind of does a shit job explaining these. They can be used to pay for a sub. But also name changes too. Then there's TWO items that can be bought in game (Somewhere? - I have no idea where as I'm only on a F2P account now) .
* What is the SP cost of those two items? I am tempted to go onto this account, pay a sub and item form and aug reset a few of my ships and send them to my F2P account, but I don't know how much it is and my guess from everything I've heard, its nowhere near worth it.


Please don't ignore this. It also ties into what I was saying here: viewtopic.php?p=726491#p726491

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Fri Jun 20, 2014 12:06 pm
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Post Re: Player List of Pre-Greenlight Necessities
Some client changes that need to occur:

H needs to be a toggle for UI visibility, not a deadman's switch as it is now.
The client needs to recognize and be able to open web links.
All text in the client needs to be selectable and copyable, including that inside chat.

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Star Sonata is not ready for a release on Steam. See this topic for what we think should be done about it.
viewtopic.php?f=107&t=59132


Fri Jun 20, 2014 1:45 pm
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