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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
He did say "extremely powerful enemies" :P

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Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:16 am
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
There must be a way to keep it doable for classes that don't have massive hulls.


For example, SD/Sniper should be able to do it just/almost as easily as an Engineer with 5k free space.


Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:20 pm
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
You "could" get some 500k hull on a Singularity Sphere as a seer, but if you intend to tank it, better bring a Monkey in the Sphere augged for tanking...a bit. I think the idea would be to send out a combat squad to mine the belt, hastily bring back the material to build rudimentary base gear to fend off new waves, then rinse and repeat.


Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:23 pm
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
Encourages team play hell yes.

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Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:21 pm
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
SodaPop wrote:
There must be a way to keep it doable for classes that don't have massive hulls.


For example, SD/Sniper should be able to do it just/almost as easily as an Engineer with 5k free space.


The idea is that this will be a team effort, and all classes would be useful.

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Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:34 pm
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
Again, very happy about SM21, sounds good


Still worried about the gap between large, established teams and smaller ones. If SM21 is as hard to get as the other 21 skills (and the gear as expensive) then only powerful wealthy people will end up with it. Which is the way it should be, don't get me wrong. But certain teams can absolutely steamroll other teams without a second thought, and they just don't care. Small team building in wild space? Build in their system if it isn't owned yet, or just blow it up. What are they gonna do? SM21 may protect bases from t21 ships (what about t22?) but it cements the ever growing endgame powerbase.

i'm mad because i don't have nice things and it's hard to get nice things because the people with nice things treat people like me generally poorly

/whiny rant


SM21 sounds good, just try to spread out the workload instead of making it all about combat. Will Station Masters have this easy? Will EE have a hell of a time with combat? Are CAs gonna just sit around and suck their thumbs? At least MFMs can use slaves to mine resources faster. Or will each element be required to get SM21? Example: You have to mine a large amount of resources against ever increasing waves of AI and sell a certain amount to a colony, peasants can be bought at a nearby AI base. MFMs can get a ton of peasants from said AI base. EEs can get a ton of the resources. SMs can protect them all easily. CAs will need less peasants and rations to make the colony worthwhile. Get it?


Thu Jun 06, 2013 4:04 am
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
JeffL wrote:
SodaPop wrote:
There must be a way to keep it doable for classes that don't have massive hulls.


For example, SD/Sniper should be able to do it just/almost as easily as an Engineer with 5k free space.


The idea is that this will be a team effort, and all classes would be useful.


This is a great time for me to plug the idea for "industrial freighters," i.e. a new line of ships that make it possible for every class to build equally well. Right now we have the Emperor's Behemoth for Support Focus and the Massif 3 for Fleet Focus, but there is no alternative for Recon and Combat Focuses that would let you hold even one piece of Annihilator gear or one Kasa Quu drone.

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Thu Jun 06, 2013 7:42 am
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
anilv wrote:
JeffL wrote:
SodaPop wrote:
There must be a way to keep it doable for classes that don't have massive hulls.


For example, SD/Sniper should be able to do it just/almost as easily as an Engineer with 5k free space.


The idea is that this will be a team effort, and all classes would be useful.


This is a great time for me to plug the idea for "industrial freighters," i.e. a new line of ships that make it possible for every class to build equally well. Right now we have the Emperor's Behemoth for Support Focus and the Massif 3 for Fleet Focus, but there is no alternative for Recon and Combat Focuses that would let you hold even one piece of Annihilator gear or one Kasa Quu drone.


For base building sing sphere works equally well among all classes once you have the aptitude for it.

Emp behe and massif 3 were both emp items (I believe) and so are natural in being different. I'm sure there's room for a future emperor to implement recon and combat versions but let's not steal away from something that was implemented through hard ingame work.


Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:04 am
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
Massif III was not introduced as an emperor item. Joey's Emperor item is the Singularity Brake. Base building is a fundamental part of the game and it would be really unwise to discourage Combat/Recon classes from being able to haul equipment around the size that Fleet/Support can do. It also makes no sense whatsoever to tell a new player he or she must put out for a ~20b ship at level 500 to move some Andaman gear, and it makes even less sense (is that even possible?) to tell a new player to reclass, because there are people out there that will use that argument, for building bases.

Base building is a universal activity.


Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:24 am
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
Well we do have 5 characters per account and could easily use a slot for a base builder which is what almost everyone does atm.

It would be cool to have some recon focus freighters...

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Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:32 am
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
There was a time when SM was actually hard to get, hopefully this makes it that way ;P

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Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:41 am
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
plis geif my 700 speed 50k hull speed demon locked Flamberge

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Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:06 pm
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
@reddy cruger

Quote:
Well we do have 5 characters per account and could easily use a slot for a base builder which is what almost everyone does atm.


Normal casual players rarely make more than two really powerful characters per account, if they even decide on a second character. Some players don't even make use of a class that could be used for base building. To give you an example, my account is more or less two strong characters that I spent 98% of my game time one, and four really weak characters that I rarely spent time on.

My two main characters are seer and sniper, both of which are horrible for attempting base building. If I didn't already have a decent storage character (the shield monkey), I wouldn't even have deployed bases from my account.

Quote:
It would be cool to have some recon focus freighters


No, that's not the point of Enkelin's argument. Providing strong freighters for Recon/Combat will simply be way overpowered on Fleet/Support, and locking such ships is just plain stupid. Jeff_L and the rest of the devmins have testified that they don't like huge amounts of skill locked items because it takes the fun out of the game.

Enkelin's suggestion merely introduces an entirely new ship hull, in which no one has bonuses for, so any class can be just as good as any other class in base building. A secondary part of Enk's suggestion would probably be the removal of current "building" ships, or a restructure to make them legitimate combat ships.




@Rice President

Quote:
There was a time when SM was actually hard to get, hopefully this makes it that way


No, just no. The "hard" part should be obtaining the uber gear, not getting the skills, unless you propose making the uber gear easier to get? Still, it's a stupid idea that skills should be harder than the gear for obtainment.


Thu Jun 06, 2013 2:01 pm
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
Well, SM actually meant something back in the day. Now you just throw some credits at it.

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Thu Jun 06, 2013 2:21 pm
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Post Re: Station Management 21 Galaxy
Rounder wrote:
Well, SM actually meant something back in the day. Now you just throw some credits at it.


Gear was probably fairly easy to obtain then. The problem is that gear tends to be considerably harder to obtain than the skill; no need to make the skill hard to obtain unless you are deliberately developing a bottleneck for the game here.


Thu Jun 06, 2013 2:39 pm
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