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Main: king kone
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
heylo wrote:
Also, admins have been stepping it up over the past 6-8 months so props to them. Theyre in high gear and I hope they keep going at this pace.


I have nothing but praise for the additions that the admins are putting into the game.

I have nothing but disdain for the stuff that aren't modified because some other dev that isn't here right now made.

How many things need to be done? Low level content. Class "balance". Class solo ability. Setup options for "Sandbox". Nexus Tutorial (again). More zones the size of UZ/Oly/Subspace. Consistent skill training options. More viable combat strats at low level other than get a bunch of slaves. Non-shitty low level equipment. Information explained better to newer players. Holiday loot is actual progression loot instead of cosmetic stuff. Can go on and on and on.

Those are what get skipped over. I love the fact base gear got rebalanced. I love the missile scaling rebalance. I love the perma drone additions. The stuff done lately is great.

I'm sitting here, year after year, waiting for the stuff that all the Redditors complained of to be done, changed, and or fixed.....And not seeing any devmins willing to hop off the wagon and get to work.

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Wed May 04, 2016 7:28 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
MasterTrader wrote:
I just want more new people playing so I can get some Americans/Canadians on in the afternoon/evening... Tired of only playing in the morning when those damn commie euros are online...

CLXXXIII being chief amongst them...

Make this game accessible to more people, somehow someway!



Im nocturnal sorry :?

Unpopular opinion, but i have to agree with a lot of what church is saying. Sure he exaggerates a great amount but also lots of truths to his rants.

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Wed May 04, 2016 7:54 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
carterstrain wrote:
Low level content.
done and more coming

Class "balance".

done

Class solo ability.

you mean in the low level? agreed

Setup options for "Sandbox". Nexus Tutorial (again).

they just announced this…

More zones the size of UZ/Oly/Subspace.

in progress, we can assume…

Consistent skill training options.

those words don't mean anything

More viable combat strats at low level other than get a bunch of slaves. Non-shitty low level equipment. Information explained better to newer players. Holiday loot is actual progression loot instead of cosmetic stuff. Can go on and on and on.


Evidently, half the things you have listed as "stuff you've been complaining about for years that's never been done" have actually already been done or have been announced as in progress.

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Wed May 04, 2016 7:56 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
C2 was in progress for most of the history of this game.


Wed May 04, 2016 8:08 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
Consistent skill training.

->From Tech 3 to Tech 19, you go to some galaxy, bring some kind of item, and grab your skill.

->At Tech 20, you kill a certain uber, get a certain commod from that uber, and train your skill. Some skills use pre-uber mechanics like The Dark for Radar 19 & 20, though.

->At Tech 21, you kill various Pretender ubers for Shards or do Dailies for Shard Dust, turned into individual Shards, to train your skills.

->At Tech 22, you kill a certain uber, get a certain commod from that uber, and train your skill.

WHAT PART OF CONSISTENT IS THIS SHIT

====

Class solo ability

->At all levels. But low level in particular.

====

Class balance

->More so having more options as a class rather than true balance. Sandbox-y nature, classes are effectively restricted to one armor type (LF, HF, SF, or CS). Useless as shit spacemines. Anti-stealth mechanics // bad stealth synergy. Gunner only one to use missiles well, but missiles no locked to Gunner? Eyezer of Light. Temp Drone Equip Slots based on ship hull, pigeonholing Engineer into Support Freighters.

Uh huhhhh. Sandbox game on Steam.

I have yet to find a reason to drag a SD, Seer, Sniper, or Zerk INACAPSHIP, along on a run because of Aura Amping FCs being so fucking much better.

====

This is the 4th or 5th time they're redoing the Nexus. Nothing on instancing the Nexus for new players when things get crowded, though.

====

Low level content and content in general

->The old low level content are out of touch with reality of the game. The rewards for doing them are designed for people who realistically cannot do it (barring RC classes) at such low level.

->New low level content, while good, are still rather ... sparse. And don't say you can just go DG. That's not what I'm measuring.

->High level content is also lacking, specifically Challenge Mode content for Tech 16 to Tech 21, and non-Challenge Mode content for Tech 22 (looking at you PPS).

->Roaming and DG bosses have rather small drop tables, if any. That level 600 Bana Roaming Boss has nothing on its table.

->Roaming bosses have no special cues (Barring RNF, Bana King, and Guru) to IF it's actually supposed to be a boss. There is no additional reason to hunt them down, either, as the DG version has same drop chances, or the roaming boss has terrible drops. Roaming Nate has this ridiculous respawn timer that was never actually changed.

->High level dungeons don't feature Delquad/Hive/Battlestation/Hawk/Drop rooms yet. Not that there are high level non-PPS/SS dungeons anyways.

->Now that there are special galaxies for Olympus Dailies, maybe the Olympus Roamers can give more than 0 exp per kill?

====

It was said that low level superitems are intentionally overpowered, and high level superitems are intentionally underwhelming, to get noobs to use them. Turned out between them and RC, low level weapons are like 'a rounding error'. Feels like no one wanted to balance low level content so they added a number of superitems to bandaid fix that shit.

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Wed May 04, 2016 8:51 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
carterstrain wrote:
MCing is Multi-clienting, or more commonly known as, Multiboxing. It is the act of having more than one client or box open on your computer at any one time, allowing the player to use two characters (or more) at once, trivializing combat for the most part. Tank not having enough shields to last through the boss fight? No worries, just grab a healer and essentially give him free shields!

In other games, MCers make up less than 1% of the playerbase because the game is much more complex and shifting. You need to take action immediately to react to bosses and NPCs. In SS, combat is very sluggish, maps are rather small, and everything gives you time to read a book before reacting to it. The admins then added Alt_Spacebar and Alt_Spacebrake to help with it. They dumbed down the endgame challenge raids because MCers (with 5+ accounts each) didn't want to play and complained it was way too hard to MC. The MC to non-MC player ratio is closer to a 1:3 level. At least 25% of all players have MCed. Of course, MCers foot the bill and thus the admins HAVE to cater to them or they lose about 80% of their subscriptions and bankrupt the game within a month.

--

About 5% of new players skip the Nexus entirely, wanting to learn how to play the game by playing the game.

They immediately run into issues because the game owner is big on the "keep the game mysterious to the point of trial and error movement controls" train of thought. It's cool. He wants each and every time he logs in (even if it was five minutes ago) to be different and new. But information is kept from the player in order to facilitate this.

As such, they become frustrated and leave very quickly.

The responses to my in game encyclopedia suggestion for spreading out the tutorial based on stimuli received and then storing the information in a kind of easy to access journal for later usage basically resulted in stuff like:

'That sounds like work'
'Too complicated'
'Got better things to do'
'Not an issue this very second'
'Not going in because you suggested it'

I have no faith in the admins outside their little pet projects.

--

Also.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaBYjVBY_bM



MC = MB got it.

I see the devs dilemma when it comes to Multi Box play given the current state of the game. On the one hand, they pay the bills, on the other, their presence in the game is a massive turn off for other players to compete with them at the same level. The curve is just too steep.

On one hand, they could simply re-design combat a bit around needing to react to every situation in order to be effective. Nobody would even dream of multiboxing a game like LoL or Star Craft and think they could be effective.

Perhaps a few more RTS like attention requiring action/reaction items, such as AI that is smart enough to focus slaves down like a player does.

Or new weapons that create temporary shield barriers that prevent the use of shield transference, or other things that force a player to move the ship out of the range of it, like a sitting on a sun is a bad idea. Or weapons that disrupt the setting and control of slaves. Turn off Fight Enemies for example, forcing a pay attention moment for the player.

On the other hand, doing so would obviously upset and probably drive away current paying customers.

It's quite the catch 22. The only answer I can think of that could work, is to create enough interest and fun activity somewhere between where MB players participate, and where new and old players alike who are happy to fight in a less competitive and abused level, can operate without needing to worry about those who are at the top of the pile because of MB.

Not experienced enough to know what that would look like, but I suspect it falls in somewhere around higher level players being locked out of PvP with middle/low end players, such as an area dedicated to levels 1000-2000 that only they can build bases in, and has some form of protection from high level ass hattery.

There is a good reason that most games have protection for lower level players from getting pwnd by higher level ones. It's a bit of a shame that this game seems to only has two models of play. Too weak to care, or to hard to overcome

I don't think the answer is that magic level 90 jump that WoW did. That is simply writing off all the early content completely.


Wed May 04, 2016 11:49 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
In general MMO's, tend to make the early game so much easier. That is a strategy to hook players in keep playing, and buckle them for harder content. In Star Sonata, lvling isn't really given out, how to do it. If you are leaving the Nexus and entering Sol the first, you will see some lv3k+ players AFK. The universe is so big, that you have no idea where to start.

All the mission text and whatnot is so big, that it's annoying to read and time consuming. The tutorial is also text heavy.

People MC because there aren't enough players that are decently geared: it's easier to make your own character and gear it, then wait on someone else to do it in the team. That is what I've experienced in Star Revolution X. That's how I mainly started to MC, I started of with 1 Account, took the account of my brother, since he quit; now I have 3 accounts, because people in the team kept making Fleet Commanders and Gunners, just because they are so much easier to lvl and get solo content done with. I've been experimenting with doing content on Engineer and Sniper, and it's quite possible, just needs a bit more training and knowing how to do stuff.

Getting content done, when you don't have to wait for people to come online is much more convenient. And people actually pay for getting more accounts subbed, they pay more for the game, so they should be able to get something in return.

New players see what the end-gamers are able to do, said new players also want to be able to do the same; but they don't want to spend the same amount of time & effort the end-gamers have spend to reach that point. The said curve is being made steep by the player itself, not by the game. The game could prevent that: make it so that there are multiple main galaxies such a Sol. Alot of the MMO's I've seen, try to split the lvls. If new-people have no contact with end game players, they'll not make the curve so steep; hoping they'll form teams, advance through the content together. Make layers where only people inbetween lvls can enter the dungeons, deploy bases, PvP & BvB, ... Although, these ideas would take a long time before they can be made.


Thu May 05, 2016 1:28 am
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
KonanCruss wrote:
In general MMO's, tend to make the early game so much easier. That is a strategy to hook players in keep playing, and buckle them for harder content. In Star Sonata, lvling isn't really given out, how to do it. If you are leaving the Nexus and entering Sol the first, you will see some lv3k+ players AFK. The universe is so big, that you have no idea where to start.

All the mission text and whatnot is so big, that it's annoying to read and time consuming. The tutorial is also text heavy.

People MC because there aren't enough players that are decently geared: it's easier to make your own character and gear it, then wait on someone else to do it in the team. That is what I've experienced in Star Revolution X. That's how I mainly started to MC, I started of with 1 Account, took the account of my brother, since he quit; now I have 3 accounts, because people in the team kept making Fleet Commanders and Gunners, just because they are so much easier to lvl and get solo content done with. I've been experimenting with doing content on Engineer and Sniper, and it's quite possible, just needs a bit more training and knowing how to do stuff.

Getting content done, when you don't have to wait for people to come online is much more convenient. And people actually pay for getting more accounts subbed, they pay more for the game, so they should be able to get something in return.

New players see what the end-gamers are able to do, said new players also want to be able to do the same; but they don't want to spend the same amount of time & effort the end-gamers have spend to reach that point. The said curve is being made steep by the player itself, not by the game. The game could prevent that: make it so that there are multiple main galaxies such a Sol. Alot of the MMO's I've seen, try to split the lvls. If new-people have no contact with end game players, they'll not make the curve so steep; hoping they'll form teams, advance through the content together. Make layers where only people inbetween lvls can enter the dungeons, deploy bases, PvP & BvB, ... Although, these ideas would take a long time before they can be made.



Not sure how hard it would be to separate the layers a bit.

Warp 0, everyone can lay bases, EF space, no PvP.
Warp 1, Bases by players below 1000, PvP only if you are below that level.
Warp 2, Bases by players below 1500, PvP only if you are below that level.
Warp 3, Bases by any players, Open PvP for all.

Could even break the sub levels out, so that for access to the Warp one area, 5SP month, warp 2 10SP and Warp 3 20SP.

Make sub access not based on travel, but on base building. So once get the appropriate warp skill level you can travel anywhere, without building anything, but to get into the base game, you need to sub.

Of course there are probably a ton of problems with this idea, but if as Jeff says it takes 3 months to convert to sub, maybe a lower intro sub level would be better, rather than the current all or nothing approach.


Thu May 05, 2016 5:27 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
PsyRamius wrote:
Warp 0, everyone can lay bases, EF space, no PvP.
Warp 1, Bases by players below 1000, PvP only if you are below that level.
Warp 2, Bases by players below 1500, PvP only if you are below that level.
Warp 3, Bases by any players, Open PvP for all.


Most endgamers have plenty of rando mid-level alts that they could use to circumvent the intention of this setup.

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Thu May 05, 2016 5:32 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
anilv wrote:
PsyRamius wrote:
Warp 0, everyone can lay bases, EF space, no PvP.
Warp 1, Bases by players below 1000, PvP only if you are below that level.
Warp 2, Bases by players below 1500, PvP only if you are below that level.
Warp 3, Bases by any players, Open PvP for all.


Most endgamers have plenty of rando mid-level alts that they could use to circumvent the intention of this setup.


Probably, but at least the would not be able to bring the high tech gear to bear.

Perhaps a dual limit of level and base level would be needed.

Or

The limit is placed based on the players highest level character from the account, rather than the currently active character. If they want to build an entire account for the lower warps then that really doesn't separate them that much from other players who also have the same 5 character limitation.

I would also think that every base slot not deployed in Warp 3 would weaken their presence in that area, but then again I don't know much about that.


Thu May 05, 2016 5:45 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
Stop trying to protect people with artificial limits, and instead continue with the current theme:

Let people build their galaxies up with disposable, nontransferable gear/drones/augs/factories/extractors. Its cheaper but takes more time and you have to do it every universe.

And keep the permanent gear that is more expensive, and a bit weaker than fully upgraded gear, but is permanent and can be transferred over multiple universes.

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Thu May 05, 2016 7:21 pm
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
MasterTrader wrote:
Stop trying to protect people with artificial limits, and instead continue with the current theme:

Let people build their galaxies up with disposable, nontransferable gear/drones/augs/factories/extractors. Its cheaper but takes more time and you have to do it every universe.

And keep the permanent gear that is more expensive, and a bit weaker than fully upgraded gear, but is permanent and can be transferred over multiple universes.


This.

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Fri May 06, 2016 8:11 am
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
So how does that solve that the Premiums that quit because they got their ass kicked?
Because, right now, the game isn't in a good shape; people that are paying are leaving. The drain is bigger then the source currently. So you do something to make the drain smaller, or you do something for the source to be bigger. From what I've seen with these suggestions, you aren't doing either of those.


Fri May 06, 2016 9:08 am
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
KonanCruss wrote:
So how does that solve that the Premiums that quit because they got their ass kicked?
Because, right now, the game isn't in a good shape; people that are paying are leaving. The drain is bigger then the source currently. So you do something to make the drain smaller, or you do something for the source to be bigger. From what I've seen with these suggestions, you aren't doing either of those.


Base building needs to be streamlined. Everyone can agree on that.

The number one rule in Eve Online is: "Don't fly what you can't afford to lose." Everyone. Says. This. Players AND developers.

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Fri May 06, 2016 9:22 am
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Post Re: p2p Benefits
Yea except we're super carebear on ship and gear loss and total war on bases. WTB consistency

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