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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
redalert150 wrote:
The dps output of FCs is somewhat balanced to me right now. FC is not meant to be one of the top dps classes, which is what it was with 5 wild bots. It's role is more support based then anything.


That would make sense if we actually had support abilities. We dont and never have though except for our ability to run 1 aura at a time. Real support skills would be things like debuffs we could fire at AI, or other unique beams we could fire at alllies to temporarily buff or help them, etc.

Im all for keeping FC dps "meh" but turning it into a real support class.... I just dont see that happening real soon.


Thu Dec 01, 2016 12:59 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
I keep advocating 5 superitem slots per character, but each time it comes up the dev team shoots it down for some reason. Other "normal" MMOs have at least 5 ability slots.

In terms of total super items, there are very little general use (aka, not class locked) superitems. Theres that Torpedo Barrage and the Glacial Freeze...and so far those are the only two I've encountered in playing for a month. That's bad. I encountered all 40 of my abilities as a Ranger in Guild Wars 2, and at least 70% of the potential abilities I could use in Star Trek Online, within 10 minutes of making a new character.

I couldn't use them all, nor could I pick and choose, because they weren't unlocked at such low level. But I could see what I was getting long before I would get them. I was also limited to a set amount. Five for GW2, and five to eight for STO.

The balance for class superitems is laughable, too. There are separate tiers of each superitem. People tend to get annoyed when a new unlocked ability is a renamed old ability with better bonuses. There are 6 Crucible missions. Why aren't there 6 different class locked super items? Why aren't there more than 3? What makes 3 such a raging, veiny, throbbing hard on number that the dev team MUST have above all other numbers?


Thu Dec 01, 2016 1:20 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
Pontius123 wrote:
My opinion:

FC slaves -- Best all round slave, best natural regen because FCs don't have healing output of ShMs/Engineers. Sustained DPS only 25% better than ShM and Burst damage roughly 75% of Zerk/Gunner, but features range, speed, and the regen to survive on their own while the FC orchestrates the battlefield around his ship.

Gunner slaves -- Massive, but unscaling damage output. Huge versatility, but a LOT less versatile if anything has chain/splash weapons which suppress missile usage.

Zerk slaves -- Best burst damage, good versatility, but horrendously slow and no natural regen. Best for close quarter fights where you have healers present.

ShM slaves -- Strong damage bonus, most shields, and ShM is present for heals. Slow ass slaves, though. Bad sustain and lacks Zerk burst. Best for grinding down enemies.

Engineer slaves -- Extreme versatility because bonus slave tweak, but nonexistent bonus stats outside some resists. Best for constantly changing environment where you need backup as you deploy and redeploy drones.

After reading FP: FC combat slaves need a buff. Slave Mastery used to be 2%.



It is a simple but necessary buff, 100% agreed!


Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:39 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
dreadlordnaf wrote:
redalert150 wrote:
The dps output of FCs is somewhat balanced to me right now. FC is not meant to be one of the top dps classes, which is what it was with 5 wild bots. It's role is more support based then anything.


That would make sense if we actually had support abilities. We dont and never have though except for our ability to run 1 aura at a time. Real support skills would be things like debuffs we could fire at AI, or other unique beams we could fire at alllies to temporarily buff or help them, etc.

Im all for keeping FC dps "meh" but turning it into a real support class.... I just dont see that happening real soon.



What if slaves weren't so stupid? Or if you could deploy them? They'd be useful in runs if they weren't so stupid.

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Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:27 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
Tomzta09 wrote:
dreadlordnaf wrote:
redalert150 wrote:
The dps output of FCs is somewhat balanced to me right now. FC is not meant to be one of the top dps classes, which is what it was with 5 wild bots. It's role is more support based then anything.


That would make sense if we actually had support abilities. We dont and never have though except for our ability to run 1 aura at a time. Real support skills would be things like debuffs we could fire at AI, or other unique beams we could fire at alllies to temporarily buff or help them, etc.

Im all for keeping FC dps "meh" but turning it into a real support class.... I just dont see that happening real soon.



What if slaves weren't so stupid? Or if you could deploy them? They'd be useful in runs if they weren't so stupid.


While smarter or more "portable" slaves would be nice, the main issue is their resistances. For the FC their slaves are the weakest defensively and often end up being a heal-soak due to how often they get hit and their poor resist, resulting in wasted drone heals. So the FC has to choose between a radical high resist aug setup which gives the slave sad DPS, or to go without them on high end runs and then just be a gimped fleet-less FC.

All other classes can go without slaves and still be useful in runs, FC slaves need higher resist so they can more effectively bring their slaves with them and serve a purpose in higher end content. Making their slave mastery skill also affect resist would go a long ways in helping this.


Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:05 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
Resistances don't technically need to be changed. What will happen is Slave Mastery gets 1.5% resists per level for 6 months, and then it'd be removed when the resistance rework comes into effect. People will get mad that FC is nerfed yet again.

The problem was that content was scaled off of the asinine resistances that Berserker could get in ships like the poseidon wave and wrathful warrior. Anything that wasn't 1. a heal bot, 2. a dedicated tank, or 3. pure dps, were useless to the group. Slaves fulfill a mixed dps/tank role.

At the lower end (anything T5 to T18), resistances range from poor to nonexistent. Combine this with AI getting AT and players off putting AT until higher levels, and damage in anything but a FC/Gunner being dismal, and you get situations where capital ship classes have to play like SDs to survive.

So the eventual rework will buff up all the lower end ships, nerf down all the higher end ships, and rework the damage output of content to fit ships with a resistance profile similar to a zebra.

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Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:44 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
Pontius123 wrote:
Resistances don't technically need to be changed. What will happen is Slave Mastery gets 1.5% resists per level for 6 months, and then it'd be removed when the resistance rework comes into effect. People will get mad that FC is nerfed yet again.

The problem was that content was scaled off of the asinine resistances that Berserker could get in ships like the poseidon wave and wrathful warrior. Anything that wasn't 1. a heal bot, 2. a dedicated tank, or 3. pure dps, were useless to the group. Slaves fulfill a mixed dps/tank role.

At the lower end (anything T5 to T18), resistances range from poor to nonexistent. Combine this with AI getting AT and players off putting AT until higher levels, and damage in anything but a FC/Gunner being dismal, and you get situations where capital ship classes have to play like SDs to survive.

So the eventual rework will buff up all the lower end ships, nerf down all the higher end ships, and rework the damage output of content to fit ships with a resistance profile similar to a zebra.


I wasnt even aware of this.. Im curious to read up more but have been out of it awhile. Was this in a dev blog?


Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:51 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
SoonTM.

(Year, or so down the road.)

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Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:06 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
Pontius123 wrote:
SoonTM.

(Year, or so down the road.)



A year? Aw man. Thats in SS time too, so like 5 to 7 years for regular people. I hope there is some adjustments before then...


Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:56 pm
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Post Re: Data on the sad weakness of FC combat slaves
Tomzta09 wrote:
What if slaves weren't so stupid? Or if you could deploy them? They'd be useful in runs if they weren't so stupid.


viewtopic.php?p=754144#p754144

I suggested allowing people to hotkey botgroups ages ago...it never went in. Still like the idea of being able to direct my Infernos at one enemy, my Cruisers at another, and my Betas at a third.

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Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:43 am
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