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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
Pot, kettle, kettle, pot.

Maxa, if you want to propose that Buffers be used as prom storage, please, feel free to make a suggestion to that effect. I have already proposed that Prom Belts where to rare and more needed to be made available, by my recollection you opposed that vehemently. Arguing that Sub buffer prices are fine because prom is so rare after arguing that prom needed to be kept rare (or was perfectly available to anyone who wanted any, you switched tracks a few times in that thread) is called circular reasoning.

Nothing you have said justifies buffers having a base sell rate higher then their production cost while every other t0/t0.5 IC has a base sell rate of 1/2 production.

Also, you seriously expect me to believe that in the 1/6th of WS SRX has grabbed not a single prom belt exists? But you are the one who argued tooth and nail we did not need more prom access.

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 4:40 am
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
lrellok wrote:
... you seriously expect me to believe that in the 1/6th of WS SRX has grabbed not a single prom belt exists? But you are the one who argued tooth and nail we did not need more prom access.


Strawman?


Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:08 am
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
10 galaxies is not "1/6 of Wild Space".

I speak specifically of my sector, which is 10 galaxies. I do not manage literally every galaxy in SRX.

About 66% of Promethium production comes from Fermium extractors, not belts. Belts are easy to access, though, which makes it easier for smaller teams to get production going. It is also easier to see, meaning you don't need to lug around the Eniac at first glance, again, better for small teams who may not have a super fast eniac ship.

Prom decays, Prom is not basically unlimited, AI bases can be fought over.

Last universe, despite the lucrative profit from SSB, only half of the IC bases were being supplied. You tell me why this would be.


Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:33 am
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
iwnh01 wrote:
lrellok wrote:
... you seriously expect me to believe that in the 1/6th of WS SRX has grabbed not a single prom belt exists? But you are the one who argued tooth and nail we did not need more prom access.


Strawman?


viewtopic.php?f=3&t=63277&start=150


Max235 wrote:
10 galaxies is not "1/6 of Wild Space".

I speak specifically of my sector, which is 10 galaxies. I do not manage literally every galaxy in SRX.
YOu should not be managing any galaxies in SRX, that is sundogs job, to ensure that all his team members have access to the resources they need to prosper.

Max235 wrote:
About 66% of Promethium production comes from Fermium extractors, not belts. Belts are easy to access, though, which makes it easier for smaller teams to get production going. It is also easier to see, meaning you don't need to lug around the Eniac at first glance, again, better for small teams who may not have a super fast eniac ship.
Not seeing how this is relevant, but ok.

Max235 wrote:
Prom decays, Prom is not basically unlimited, AI bases can be fought over.
Metals are not unlimited either, nor are nukes, nor are silicon.

Max235 wrote:
Last universe, despite the lucrative profit from SSB, only half of the IC bases were being supplied. You tell me why this would be.


I am going to assume you are speaking of all IC here and not just buffers, as you do not specify. And i would guess that is because i have repeatedly been told NO ONE SELLS the lower tier single commodity items because they are not worth it compared to buffers. Because otherwise, you opposition a month ago to more prom access is not merely absurd, but openly counterproductive to expanding the game.

And not one thing said here has any relation to the fact that buffers sell for half again their build costs.

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:48 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
Actually I do mean Buffers. Lucrative or not, every bit of Promethium thrown into Buffers is Promethium you can't get back. It is not fun trying to build Exterms, Base gear, augs, ships, gear, you name it...without prom. Especially Exterms. Also Station Suites.

Compared to Prom, Metals are unlimited. Every single galaxy we (us 4) have has at least 500 extractors, compared to the two galaxies with fermium (and the second gal has enukes and I couldn't be assed to extract the fermium). We're pulling in 1m Steel Girders a day, which roughly equates to 5b a day. Metals.


Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:37 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
Max235 wrote:
Lucrative or not, every bit of Promethium thrown into Buffers is Promethium you can't get back. It is not fun trying to build Exterms, Base gear, augs, ships, gear, you name it...without prom. Especially Exterms. Also Station Suites.


Allow me to assure you maxa, i am very well aware that WS costs 200,000 prom per gal without counting Laconia SHeets, which bring the total to 400,000. I just did a 13 page thread centered around that point. Where in you and the entire dev team lambasted me for saying we needed more prom sources in game. So you will understand if i have less then no interest in listening to how rare prom is as a justification for anything at all, you CHOOSE for prom to be that rare, that was YOUR CHOICE.

Part of the purpose of this suggestion is that people STOP THROWING PROM AT BUFFERS, either because they are lower in price (preferably) that other IC are higher in price (not so good) or that more spaces to sell non buffers are available, thus making non buffers more attractive. SO nothing you are going to argue about prom in any way detracts from this suggestion. We already covered that, unless you are reopening that issue...

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 4:29 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
No one makes Laconia Sheets via the Enuke route with Prom+Nukes, besides you of course. The cost is too great and at that point I'd opt to use raw Laconia. Instead, people extract enukes.


Thu Nov 23, 2017 4:48 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
Max235 wrote:
No one makes Laconia Sheets via the Enuke route with Prom+Nukes, besides you of course. The cost is too great and at that point I'd opt to use raw Laconia. Instead, people extract enukes.


This. Or they just buy Lac sheets on the market for 12m per. That's usually the going rate.

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:06 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
Max235 wrote:
No one makes Laconia Sheets via the Enuke route with Prom+Nukes, besides you of course. The cost is too great and at that point I'd opt to use raw Laconia. Instead, people extract enukes.


...so you still need 200,000 per galaxy....also, where is this Enuk extraction in EF layer please, i am very interested. And what the heck does any of this have to do with the price of single commodity IC?

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:10 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
lrellok wrote:
Max235 wrote:
No one makes Laconia Sheets via the Enuke route with Prom+Nukes, besides you of course. The cost is too great and at that point I'd opt to use raw Laconia. Instead, people extract enukes.


...so you still need 200,000 per galaxy....also, where is this Enuk extraction in EF layer please, i am very interested. And what the heck does any of this have to do with the price of single commodity IC?


IDK, you're the one who brought it up. And again, you should buy Lac sheets on the market, not attempt to build them yourself in the EF layer.

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:12 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
"I'm going to need that item eventually"


Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:50 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
anilv wrote:
IDK, you're the one who brought it up. And again, you should buy Lac sheets on the market, not attempt to build them yourself in the EF layer.


Max235 wrote:
Actually I do mean Buffers. Lucrative or not, every bit of Promethium thrown into Buffers is Promethium you can't get back. It is not fun trying to build Exterms, Base gear, augs, ships, gear, you name it...without prom. Especially Exterms. Also Station Suites.


Max is the one who brought it up, i am trying to get the conversation back on the topic of single commodity IC. In any event, Both t0 and t0.5 commodities are priced at half there construction cost or less, only buffers are priced differently. That Prom has a 25 minute decay is not relevant as in the 60 seconds it takes the plant to proc you are not going to loose enough to make a difference. That prom is used for many builds is not relevant because so is every other commodity. That prom is rare is circular reasoning, as you have argued that prom should be rare. So i am not hearing any actual argumentation against this suggestion.

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:05 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
So, you're asking me to make Sub-Shield buffers sell for less?

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:20 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
anilv wrote:
So, you're asking me to make Sub-Shield buffers sell for less?


Any of the following three options i fine to be acceptable, In descending order.

1) lower Buffers to 350,000 base price (preferred)

2) raise every other t0 commodity to half again its input costs (not preferred, but i will accept it)

3) move t0 single material IC to EF layer (i seriously doubt you would do this, bit i suggest it anyway because i hate false dichotomies)

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Thu Nov 23, 2017 10:11 pm
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Post Re: Rebalance IC prices to All t0 are market viable.
This is probably the first time a player is actually asking for his setup to be nerfed. Or possibly because he can't compete with the other people around him, asking for a scorched earth nerf 'If I can't make profit off it, NO ONE CAN'.


Fri Nov 24, 2017 5:48 am
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