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Do you support this change?
Poll ended at Sun May 14, 2006 3:07 am
Yes 83%  83%  [ 55 ]
No 9%  9%  [ 6 ]
Abstain 8%  8%  [ 5 ]
Total votes : 66

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Team: Infinate Dreams
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Enji wrote:
Madferret, what I had in mind when I spoke about cash penalty is a way to loose cash as if we just used up 1 GG at slave death, without having to go through the process of having to check and replace GG in 15 slaves... I was not thinking about cash spilling out of the ship for pirates to get, only an alternative to GG that would be fair and easy to use


That could possibly work, but if your saying cash rather than have items dropping the Admins would never agree to it I'm afraid. :(

~ferret


Tue Apr 18, 2006 9:57 pm
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If a radX player has RC skill 16, then his slaves will have +4% per level to all stats, right? That's 64% increase. A 64% increase in damange * 64% increase in rof = 2.69x more dps than without bonuses. Plus there is the accompanying increase to electricity, nimbleness, shield max, shield charge, etc. This is way more powerful than a mf 2x dps, assuming the mf slave could even generate enough electricity to fire two weapons consistantly. The mf slave will probably have to use one aug slot on an electric aug just so it can keep firing. The differences will only grow more stark as people finally start to get RC 18 and eventually 20.

And I totally agree that a big problem with slaves is with controlling them. If you could tell them (and drones) who to target, they would be way way way more effective. I've mentioned before that my plan is that with the new client, you will be able to select multiple possessions of yours (slaves, drones, bases) and then do a ctrl-right-click on a target to have them attack that target, a base to have them dock at the base, a debris to have them scoop the debris, or an ally or other inanimate object to have them guard. This will make a world of difference, and because of this, I want to make sure not to buff slaves too much now so that we will have to nerf them again later. I think the moderate improvements I've suggested are just about right for right now.


Wed Apr 19, 2006 2:54 am
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JeffL wrote:
If a radX player has RC skill 16, then his slaves will have +4% per level to all stats, right? That's 64% increase. A 64% increase in damange * 64% increase in rof = 2.69x more dps than without bonuses.

Plus with a bonus to tracking, more bullets will actually hit the target.


Wed Apr 19, 2006 3:00 am
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Are you saying that it is better to be a rad x after you get rc 18 then as opposed to becoming rad x first? and aside from that, an mf slave, along with the damage THE PLAYER does, is still gonna be way more than rad x and his slaves could ever possibly do.

if rad x is so balanced how come rad x slaves are easy for SD's, MF's, and snipers to pwn, besides that, its also harder for monkeys to heal slaves because the slaves are so stupid and wont stop moving around.

needless to say, I completely disagree with you. If it aint broke dont fix it, and for god sakes, if its broke, figure out what is wrong with it.

I guess the main problem with slave masters is the cost. they are very expensive, in my opinion by far the most expensive classification, now think about how much time and effort someone puts into their slaves, and think about how powerfull slaves are atm.

you decided that slaves don't deserve aug tweaking because the boosts are too significant, here is my suggestion for that, calculate the slaves bonus, and the aug tweaking bonuses seperately, then simply add the bonuses together. for example, at sm 20 if you have a weap that does 100 damage, say slave bonus would be 90 damage, then just do the aug tweak bonus off the original 100 damage from the weap, and add the 2 bonuses together. thats fair isnt it? remember how expensive these slaves are.

Right now I need 500 mil to respec, but since i've been nerfed I cant even collect that, so no respec, no p2p, no reason to play when I cant do anything anyway. No, I'm not asking for a handout.


Wed Apr 19, 2006 3:15 am
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JeffL wrote:
and eventually 20.


That had better be at least 7x mroe difficult than iq bana.

*imagines an armada of radx reavers*

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Last edited by Nuromishi on Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

Wed Apr 19, 2006 3:48 am
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jeff where is rc 20? :P


Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:15 am
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Nuromishi wrote:
JeffL wrote:
and eventually 20.


That had beeter be at least 7x mroe difficult than iq bana.

*imagines an armada of radx reavers*


If there is RC20, I don't care what I have to do (in game) to get it, I'll do it... So long as it doesn't involve scamming, stealing the loot, or lieing in any way shape or form... 2 all ares reaver slaves with radx 20 would be fething unstoppable... Perm grems...


Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:22 am
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sure i like the adeah of un- nurfing slaves & adding other secondaries to slaves... also the non fighting & non mastery skills should get some kind of bonus as compensation as thier skills arent based on fighting. (RE, CA, EE)


Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:56 am
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As I said Jeff go play the game 1st and while you at it fix the commod bug you recently introduced :) I'm tired of posting about it.

~ferret


Wed Apr 19, 2006 6:15 am
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JeffL wrote:
First, I forgot that slave masters get 2% per level bonus and Rad experts get 2% per level. So a rad expert gets a total of 4% per level for each attribute. That makes his slaves *way* tougher than any other class's slaves who get half their skills as a bonus.

Second, a modification to the above. Slaves will not get half of all the class skills of their owners, they will only get half of the "outside" skills on the skill chart. The skills that would impart half bonuses to slaves are: Seer, Multifire, Sniper, Speed Demon, and Merchant. A multifirers slave will not have both double dps and the berserker shield bonus.

I don't think this would make the game significantly harder to balance because 1) these bonuses are not huge, 2) slaves aren't nearly as smart as players and will never be as good, 3) no one seems to use combat slaves anyway.
Finally, I've been talking with Atlum about the slave tweaking, and we are now thinking about something more along the lines of a skill that maxes out at level 50 instead of 100 and gives 1.5% per level


Well we use to before they were NERF'ed to hell and back!

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Wed Apr 19, 2006 7:46 am
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They weren't nerfed. They had the AI bonuses bestowed to normal AI as well as Aug Tweak bestowed to them. That was a bug, it was fixed, not nerfed. Call it a a nerf if you want, but it's not really a nerf.

Also.. I'm looking forward to having uber huge Merchant slaves! Man.. thats going to be awesome. Good Job Jeff (even if you're a pagan job of the masses).

Calypso

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Wed Apr 19, 2006 7:53 am
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JeffL wrote:
...This will make a world of difference, and because of this, I want to make sure not to buff slaves too much now so that we will have to nerf them again later. I think the moderate improvements I've suggested are just about right for right now.


yes, you are right, slaves do not need all that much of boost as they need better menagement, now if you guys are workinng in that direction, I applaude you :D

There is still hope :)


Wed Apr 19, 2006 8:19 am
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Quick question then, what happens to my merchant fleet master slave if I have MFM and Merchant 20?

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Wed Apr 19, 2006 8:36 am
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It becomes bloody massive... Thats what happens lol


Wed Apr 19, 2006 8:41 am
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Mmmmm, add in RC20 so I can make insanely uber MFM pax slaves. ^_^

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Wed Apr 19, 2006 8:54 am
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