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Team:
 Rank: Main: Odd One Level: 523 Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:12 pm Posts: 1326 |
 Multifire thorax bugOld thorax behavior is that the bullet moves at the speed of your ship and then after a second or two flys forward as if your ship is still moving at the speed it was when the bullet was originally launched.
New thorax behavior is that the bullet still drifts but upon moving forward, instantly forgets anything about what speed it was drifting at and moves as if your ship was sitting still. Supposedly this change was made to make thoraxes easier to use. (kitting is easier, however drifting next to an ai no longer works.) It doesn't really matter which way they work as there are ways to exploit both, though chasing down ai is now a massive pain. (hitch hiker gamma is a useful tool) ---The problem is that when multifiring thorax weapons, one bullet follows the new behavior and one follows the old behavior.--- Specifically, the left bullet follows the old behavior and the right bullet follows the new behavior. Apparently, when thorax behavior was changed, the behavior was only changed for the first bullet. _________________  http://forum.starsonata.com/download/file.php?id=8119 SunDog60 wrote: targeting my OWN slave because... reasons, and then MIRVing it. |
| Sun Apr 05, 2015 10:57 pm |
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over 9000! 
Main: enkelin
Level: 5600 Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:28 pm Posts: 11109 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug Thoraxes have behaved this way since 2010 at least, well before C2. I am skeptical of your claim. It also makes little sense to me purely from a logical standpoint:
SkyTitan wrote: Old thorax behavior is that the bullet moves at the speed of your ship and then after a second or two flys forward as if your ship is still moving at the speed it was when the bullet was originally launched. so… the bullet moves at the speed of your ship and then after a second or two keeps doing the exact same thing? I agree that something is buggy about MFed thoraxes but it's not this. The change to thoraxes that you remember actually had nothing to do with their charge-up behavior. It changed their tracking mechanics. Old system: drift while charging, fly straight for a while, then full tracking till expire. Current system: drift while charging, full tracking for a while, then drift till expire. The change was made largely for aesthetic reasons because Jeff wants torpedoes to thematically be heavy-hitting weapons used against big targets at longer range. In practice it just makes it hard to use them at long range at all. On the plus side, it did nerf BFD Stygian Fists which were insanely hard to avoid due to super long range with full tracking. _________________ Hi, I'm Anil, a long-time player turned developer. I am Star Sonata's lead content developer, which means that I run weekly dev meetings and make sure that any proposed changes to the game receive proper review before going live. http://www.starsonata.com/features |
| Mon Apr 06, 2015 12:13 am |
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Team:
Rank: Main: Odd One Level: 523 Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:12 pm Posts: 1326 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug When I say "moves at the speed of your ship" I mean while charging. The charging behavior is exactly the same. If you equip two thoraxes and drift in space, both will stay together. It's when they "fire" that the problem occurs. One takes into account its initial velocity, the other completely forgets it. New behavior is that it forgets it, old behavior is it doesn't.
Maybe it's the tracking that bugs the torpedo. Tracking bullets seem to forget their initial velocity. (magcannons being an example of this) Either way, the change made to thoraxes seems to only change the first bullet, not any additional ones from multifiring. _________________ http://forum.starsonata.com/download/file.php?id=8119 SunDog60 wrote: targeting my OWN slave because... reasons, and then MIRVing it. |
| Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:03 pm |
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over 9000!
Main: enkelin
Level: 5600 Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:28 pm Posts: 11109 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug I'm saying that there is no new/old behavior. I am not disagreeing with your diagnosis of the current problem as I haven't tested it thoroughly myself. Thoraxes have always reset to 0 speed after their charge-up period.
_________________ Hi, I'm Anil, a long-time player turned developer. I am Star Sonata's lead content developer, which means that I run weekly dev meetings and make sure that any proposed changes to the game receive proper review before going live. http://www.starsonata.com/features |
| Mon Apr 06, 2015 6:14 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Main: Odd One Level: 523 Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:12 pm Posts: 1326 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug The difference between a Torpedo and a Thorax was that a Torpedo dropped to zero speed after charging where a Thorax kept its speed. That's what I'm referring to when I saw "old thorax behavior".
I'm pretty sure that thoraxes were changed to torpedos at some point. My point is that Golden Thorax, Silver Thorax, and Torpedo all act like torpedo weapons with the first bullet and act like oldschool thorax weapons with all additional bullets. I don't have a second silver thorax to test multifire, but I remember seeing a zerk with lion v2s having the bug while firing in sol so I'm sure this bug applies to all torpedo weapons. _________________ http://forum.starsonata.com/download/file.php?id=8119 SunDog60 wrote: targeting my OWN slave because... reasons, and then MIRVing it. |
| Mon Apr 06, 2015 7:19 pm |
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Team:
 Rank: Soldier Main: LemonPrime Level: 8087 Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:14 pm Posts: 5747 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug SkyTitan wrote: The difference between a Torpedo and a Thorax was that a Torpedo dropped to zero speed after charging where a Thorax kept its speed. That's what I'm referring to when I saw "old thorax behavior". I'm pretty sure that thoraxes were changed to torpedos at some point. My point is that Golden Thorax, Silver Thorax, and Torpedo all act like torpedo weapons with the first bullet and act like oldschool thorax weapons with all additional bullets. I don't have a second silver thorax to test multifire, but I remember seeing a zerk with lion v2s having the bug while firing in sol so I'm sure this bug applies to all torpedo weapons. I use MF thoraxes on my sniper and zerker all the time and have no idea what you're referring to as a bug. Can you submit a video of the bug? Or is this all hearsay with no actual proof lol. _________________ Lemon/Meo |
| Mon Apr 06, 2015 7:28 pm |
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over 9000!
Main: enkelin
Level: 5600 Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:28 pm Posts: 11109 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug I specifically approached Jeff with my thoughts on his torpedo/thorax revamp and he confirmed that as far as the server is concerned, there is no difference whatsoever between torpedoes and thoraxes. You are simply mistaken that the change you are describing ever took place.
However, I do think I know the bug you are talking about as you will commonly see a few thoraxes attain much greater range than the rest when you MF them. _________________ Hi, I'm Anil, a long-time player turned developer. I am Star Sonata's lead content developer, which means that I run weekly dev meetings and make sure that any proposed changes to the game receive proper review before going live. http://www.starsonata.com/features |
| Mon Apr 06, 2015 7:30 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Main: Odd One Level: 523 Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:12 pm Posts: 1326 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug anilv wrote: However, I do think I know the bug you are talking about as you will commonly see a few thoraxes attain much greater range than the rest when you MF them. The reason for that is that they behave like real thoraxes instead of torpedos. They get the speed of the ship added so they get a longer range when moving forwards and less range when moving backwards. (relative to a stationary target) As I said before, Torpedo and Golden Thorax act identically to eachother in my testing. Screenshots are attached. The reason you never see the bug is that you never go fast enough, lemon. You have to actually move to see the bug. screenshot1.png is charging behavior at 117 speed screenshot2.png is postcharged behavior at 82 speed In both I am moving towards the wormhole. Notice how the speed is added on the left bullet but not on the right bullet. You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post. _________________ http://forum.starsonata.com/download/file.php?id=8119 SunDog60 wrote: targeting my OWN slave because... reasons, and then MIRVing it. |
| Tue Apr 07, 2015 3:13 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Main: Odd One Level: 523 Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:12 pm Posts: 1326 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug Further screenshots. One while moving. One without moving.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post. _________________ http://forum.starsonata.com/download/file.php?id=8119 SunDog60 wrote: targeting my OWN slave because... reasons, and then MIRVing it. |
| Tue Apr 07, 2015 3:19 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Soldier Main: LemonPrime Level: 8087 Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:14 pm Posts: 5747 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug Yea from what I can tell with testing and using /showpain, the shots are just being visually desynced. The pairs of thoraxes on my sniper hit at the same time, they just aren't flying next to each other imagewise.
_________________ Lemon/Meo |
| Tue Apr 07, 2015 4:19 pm |
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Team:
Rank: Main: Odd One Level: 523 Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:12 pm Posts: 1326 |
Re: Multifire thorax bug I did notice that not every shot does this. However, magcannons do not show this behavior.
Multiclienting shows the exact same thing on both clients. It's not a big deal when going slowly, however, when moving it quickly it's very noticeable. Golden Thorax seems to have a speed of 118. Get a fast wingship and test the Torpedo weapon. This is not hard to reproduce. You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post. _________________ http://forum.starsonata.com/download/file.php?id=8119 SunDog60 wrote: targeting my OWN slave because... reasons, and then MIRVing it. |
| Tue Apr 07, 2015 6:58 pm |
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